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catie;
I'm sorry if it brings back bad memories etc. But I recently read several books on Anne Frank and just wanted others opinion on the Holocaust. Personally I was horrified, Hitler was sick but unfortunately very charasmic. He hated Jews and was a psycho..I'm not good on writing deep thoughts but wow..it was wow, millions died just because of a single man who later commited suicide...sick..Anyways any thoughts, I would like to hear others opinions since this is such a sad topic.
Answer
~If you have read only of the Jews, you have no inkling as to what Heydrich and Himmler really did. If you have not read about the Evian Conference and Churchill's and Roosevelt's participation (or lack thereof) in it, you have no clue as to why the Nazi's felt they could safely implement Operation 14f13 without fear of reprisal, or even condemnation, from the world at large. If you have not read Magna Carte, you fail to understand that by the time the Nazi's rolled around, the Jews had been treated as second class citizens in Europe for 1000 years, maybe a few rungs more up the ladder than Blacks in America, but downtrodden by aw and custom all the same. If you have not read the pronouncements of 'Mother Church' or the 'great thinkers' of the western world over the past millennium, you cannot understand how Hitler's beliefs were more the norm than the exception, or why. If you have not read about the Spanish Inquisition, you won't realize that Hitler wasn't even the first to do what the Nazis did. And if you have not read of the exploits of the US Bureau of Indian Affairs or of the British in South Africa in the 1890's you cannot understand where Heydrich and Himmler got their ideas for the camps. If you don't understand the consequences and impact of the Treaty of Versailles of 1919, you cannot understand how a demigod such as Hitler could so quickly and completely rise to power in Germany. And if you do not read about Hitler himself and what he did after coming to power you cannot understand why he was named 'Man of the Year, 1938" by Time Magazine.
Unfortunately, the "Holocaust" has become synonymous with the murder of the Jews and it perpetuates the myth that all the Jews died in the death camps and that the death camps were designed exclusively to kill Jews and only Jews. This does a great disservice to the memory of all the other dead. Around18 million died in the camps. About 6 million of them were Jews. 30 million or so Slavs were spared because the Soviet Army repelled Operation Barbarossa and then won at Stalingrad. Stalingrad was the beginning of the end of the war and the defeat of the Germans was a certainty after they lost there. Instead of rounding up the Slavs and marching them into the ovens as had been planned, the Nazis had to devote their energies to their retreat and to the prosecution of a lost war.
You might also want to read a little about the camps. There is a huge difference between the concentration camps and the death camps. Fewer than half of the Jews who died under the National Socialists died in the death camps. Of the rest, many would have been interred in the concentration camps even had they not been Jewish. The would have worn a triangle instead of a star, but the result would have been the same. Read also about Jassenovak. That was a death camp that was not established for the Jews. And check into the number of Serbs who were slaughtered there (check the number as a percentage of the Serb population, then do the same with the Romas.) And give Uncle Sam and the Brits their fair share of the credit. The world's first concentration camps were erected in Tennessee (Van Buren called them Reservations) and the British invented the name 'concentration camp' when they built their hostels during the Boer Wars.
Don't write Hitler off as a madman. It is far too easy to do that, and doing so simply ignores the truth, both about the man and about the society of the times (not just in Germany, not just in Europe, but throughout the Western World). Read what Golda Meir and Haim Weizman had to say after attending the Evian Conference and read about "The Ship of the Damned". Goehring, Himmler and Heydrich had far more to do with the establishment, organization and operation of the camps (concentration and extermination) than Hitler did - by far. Der Fuhrer was too busy running his country and his war to be bothered with the mundane details. But insane? Hardly. Time honored him for a reason. He was a product of his times and his culture but he was in a position to do something about it, and when the world at large gave him the green light at Evian, he and his deputies went forward. But he did NOT devote his energies to the Jews and, had all the plans reached fruition, the body count would have been exponentially higher. The Jews would have constituted an even smaller minority of those killed (both in the extermination camps and in the concentration camps) if the plans for the Serbs, Romas, Poles, Russians and Slavs, to name but a handful, had been carried out.
I don't minimize what happened to the Jews. I am just enraged that the other 12 million actual victims and tens of millions of other intended victims have been forgotten and ignored. And I am appalled that history tries to excuse the entire affair by saying Hitler was mad, placing the blame solely on him and ignoring the part the rest of the world played in the process.
Then leave us not forget what Martin Van Buren, Andy Jackson, William Sheridan and Nelson Miles did, or what Stalin did, or what Mao did, or what Idi Amin did, or what Pol Pot did, or what Shah Pahlavi did, or what the Japanese and Chinese did to each other, or about more than a million Japanese civilians killed by the US bombing of Japanese cities and civilian centers before the needless nukes were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or what Diem did, or what ... well, you get the idea.
Well said, russkimuzhik. Let us not forget the Russian POWs who were killed immediately upon capture or the Russian civilians who were mowed down like wheat at harvest. Of course, some of the 25 million dead Soviet civilians must be credited to Stalin - they were not all Nazi victims.
Hey, we get our ideas from the Bible, right? If God can do it with floods, plagues and pillars of fire, why shouldn't we do it with Zyklon B, smallpox infested blankets, bullets and nukes?
Have a nice day.
~If you have read only of the Jews, you have no inkling as to what Heydrich and Himmler really did. If you have not read about the Evian Conference and Churchill's and Roosevelt's participation (or lack thereof) in it, you have no clue as to why the Nazi's felt they could safely implement Operation 14f13 without fear of reprisal, or even condemnation, from the world at large. If you have not read Magna Carte, you fail to understand that by the time the Nazi's rolled around, the Jews had been treated as second class citizens in Europe for 1000 years, maybe a few rungs more up the ladder than Blacks in America, but downtrodden by aw and custom all the same. If you have not read the pronouncements of 'Mother Church' or the 'great thinkers' of the western world over the past millennium, you cannot understand how Hitler's beliefs were more the norm than the exception, or why. If you have not read about the Spanish Inquisition, you won't realize that Hitler wasn't even the first to do what the Nazis did. And if you have not read of the exploits of the US Bureau of Indian Affairs or of the British in South Africa in the 1890's you cannot understand where Heydrich and Himmler got their ideas for the camps. If you don't understand the consequences and impact of the Treaty of Versailles of 1919, you cannot understand how a demigod such as Hitler could so quickly and completely rise to power in Germany. And if you do not read about Hitler himself and what he did after coming to power you cannot understand why he was named 'Man of the Year, 1938" by Time Magazine.
Unfortunately, the "Holocaust" has become synonymous with the murder of the Jews and it perpetuates the myth that all the Jews died in the death camps and that the death camps were designed exclusively to kill Jews and only Jews. This does a great disservice to the memory of all the other dead. Around18 million died in the camps. About 6 million of them were Jews. 30 million or so Slavs were spared because the Soviet Army repelled Operation Barbarossa and then won at Stalingrad. Stalingrad was the beginning of the end of the war and the defeat of the Germans was a certainty after they lost there. Instead of rounding up the Slavs and marching them into the ovens as had been planned, the Nazis had to devote their energies to their retreat and to the prosecution of a lost war.
You might also want to read a little about the camps. There is a huge difference between the concentration camps and the death camps. Fewer than half of the Jews who died under the National Socialists died in the death camps. Of the rest, many would have been interred in the concentration camps even had they not been Jewish. The would have worn a triangle instead of a star, but the result would have been the same. Read also about Jassenovak. That was a death camp that was not established for the Jews. And check into the number of Serbs who were slaughtered there (check the number as a percentage of the Serb population, then do the same with the Romas.) And give Uncle Sam and the Brits their fair share of the credit. The world's first concentration camps were erected in Tennessee (Van Buren called them Reservations) and the British invented the name 'concentration camp' when they built their hostels during the Boer Wars.
Don't write Hitler off as a madman. It is far too easy to do that, and doing so simply ignores the truth, both about the man and about the society of the times (not just in Germany, not just in Europe, but throughout the Western World). Read what Golda Meir and Haim Weizman had to say after attending the Evian Conference and read about "The Ship of the Damned". Goehring, Himmler and Heydrich had far more to do with the establishment, organization and operation of the camps (concentration and extermination) than Hitler did - by far. Der Fuhrer was too busy running his country and his war to be bothered with the mundane details. But insane? Hardly. Time honored him for a reason. He was a product of his times and his culture but he was in a position to do something about it, and when the world at large gave him the green light at Evian, he and his deputies went forward. But he did NOT devote his energies to the Jews and, had all the plans reached fruition, the body count would have been exponentially higher. The Jews would have constituted an even smaller minority of those killed (both in the extermination camps and in the concentration camps) if the plans for the Serbs, Romas, Poles, Russians and Slavs, to name but a handful, had been carried out.
I don't minimize what happened to the Jews. I am just enraged that the other 12 million actual victims and tens of millions of other intended victims have been forgotten and ignored. And I am appalled that history tries to excuse the entire affair by saying Hitler was mad, placing the blame solely on him and ignoring the part the rest of the world played in the process.
Then leave us not forget what Martin Van Buren, Andy Jackson, William Sheridan and Nelson Miles did, or what Stalin did, or what Mao did, or what Idi Amin did, or what Pol Pot did, or what Shah Pahlavi did, or what the Japanese and Chinese did to each other, or about more than a million Japanese civilians killed by the US bombing of Japanese cities and civilian centers before the needless nukes were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or what Diem did, or what ... well, you get the idea.
Well said, russkimuzhik. Let us not forget the Russian POWs who were killed immediately upon capture or the Russian civilians who were mowed down like wheat at harvest. Of course, some of the 25 million dead Soviet civilians must be credited to Stalin - they were not all Nazi victims.
Hey, we get our ideas from the Bible, right? If God can do it with floods, plagues and pillars of fire, why shouldn't we do it with Zyklon B, smallpox infested blankets, bullets and nukes?
Have a nice day.
I would like to know why Leonardo da Vinci could be considered the world's greatest thinker ever.?
pleaseansw
Any information, any books, any websites with factual knowledge are appreciated. Please don't discuss how wrong the Da Vinci Code is.
Answer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonardo_da_Vinci
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonardo_da_Vinci
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